Comments on: What Is Superior: Knowledge Or Reason?

By: Sumera

Sumera — Sat, 14 Apr 2007 21:24:58 +0000

This is an interesting discussion. Surely reason cannot exist without knowledge and that is where it derives from? Since reasoning devoid of knowledge is like taking a stab in the dark, its not upheld or has a foundation from which to build on.

Interesting. Thanks for this Salman!

By: Salman

Salman — Fri, 13 Apr 2007 17:26:11 +0000

salamu `alaykum

Sidi `Abd al Hakim: I would disagree somewhat with your analogy. Contrasting ray to `aql is, in my opinion, not sound. This is mainly because ray is never employed independently of the texts and is thus intimately linked to naql.

This is not the case with `aql, which purely relates to one’s independent reasoning capacity. Thus, Maulana Thanawi states in one of his work that the establishment of tawhid is achievable through reason (`aql) and does not require textual establishment (naql).

Juhah: I believe both the Ash`aris and Maturidis consider reason to be capable of establishing the existence of God. What they differ on is whether this makes one morally accountable even without the sending of a messenger. The Ash`aris say no whereas the Maturidis say yes. The latter state that the verse “We do not punish until we send a messenger” is the hikma of God – and the hikma is never binding upon Him.

Wasalam
Salman

By: .

Fri, 13 Apr 2007 16:58:35 +0000

Asslmaualikum

Can you email me please.

Jazakalah

By: jinnzaman

jinnzaman — Fri, 13 Apr 2007 14:37:41 +0000

Excellent post bro!

By: juhah

juhah — Fri, 13 Apr 2007 12:48:32 +0000

Omar, let me make sure I read that correctly: The Asha’ris agree with the Maturidis on the ability of the ‘aql to ascertain the existence of God?
I thought the Ash’aris believed it is necessary for God to send messengers so that we may know the truth.
Correct me if I’m wrong.

By: abd al-hakim

abd al-hakim — Fri, 13 Apr 2007 03:33:52 +0000

Assalaamu a’laikum,

Another nuance is how the Hanafi madhab stands apart from the others in placing a greater emphasis on ra’y (reasoning). Depending on one’s perspective, it might be argued that the prevalence of Hanafi followers in the ummah, is an indication of the triumph of ra’y. It could also be argued that the prevalence of so many leading scholars from the Shaf’i madhab, is an indication of the triumph of ilm, over ra’y/aql.

But perhaps to say all this, is its own can of worms! Just sharing my amateur observations…

By: lotusnpearls

lotusnpearls — Fri, 13 Apr 2007 02:41:45 +0000

Dear Salman…..Do you know of any Sufi groups in Toronto? Can you email me the information or you can post it here. I am interested in learning more about the Sufi Shaykhs. I am not sure, but from what I have read, you are in the US.

I apologize for being off track on the above post.

Salaam.

By: Omar

Omar — Wed, 11 Apr 2007 20:07:59 +0000

Ibn Hajar’s position is also the standard Ash’ari position as I have learned from my teachers. The Ash’aris fully agree with the Maturidis that the existence of Allah can be found through reason alone as the Qur’an clearly gives proofs for this. The difference is that the Maturidis say that this fact makes those who have been unreached by the message divinely responsible, while the Ash’aris say there is no divine responsibility on the one who was unreached by the message.

By: What Is Superior? Knowledge? Or Reason? at Ijtema

What Is Superior? Knowledge? Or Reason? at Ijtema — Wed, 11 Apr 2007 18:35:08 +0000

[...] quotes a Fatwa There is difference [of opinion] among the scholars regarding this. The preferred opinion [...]